Bikes been sitting too long, now does not want to start.

[Tempest]

I'll give you £50 for it delivered to North Devon

Send Tony.mon or Cybercarl a PM as Mac suggested, hopefully they can help you out. I'd fix it for you but you'd have to get the bike to me, someone closer will help.


Was the tap flowing when you pulled the pipes off ?, As I said you don't need to turn the tap off, if it's working correctly no fuel comes out, if it does there's a problem with the diaphragm, they can get stuck and a clean can fix them.

£50 delivered is a tiny bit on the low side

Actually I think the tap (or around there) since I have fiddled has been leaking a bit, general smell of fuel and some drips under the bike, so something it not 100% re the tap.

I did put a spanner on the square section and turn the tap off, but perhaps it needs looking at.

It's like any job, without the tools you know you need to hand (I have them just which ones) an knowing exactly what you need to do in the order you need to do it, and which bits you can avoid touching and what bits you need to touch, a straightforward to someone task, looks a nightmare you don't want to touch.

Honestli if I knew there was someone who could put it all back together I'd be happier. I just don't want to get it al in bits, then be 100x worse than I am now.

[Tempest]

Ok, well.... story continues.

Had a break and a calm down and thought I'd take another look.

disconnected the throttle cable by taking slack out of all the adjusters, only just managed to get the cables off, but done it

Unplugged the electrical connection (whatever the hell that is for!)

Then spotted metal bands around the rubber connections between the carbs and engine.
Then followed much swearing as I struggled to come up with some screwdriver, spanner, socket (you name it I tried it) to reach the screw heads of the band tighteners.... Swearing at whoever rotated then in THAT position when another position would of been 100x easier....... FINALLY got them nice and lose, then, hmmm, no movement.
More torch looking and saw there are actually two metal bands..... (even worse screw head positions)

anyway..........

Long and the short of it, all 4 bands are now nice and undone.
Choke cables still attached (see how I go with those as can't work out how they come off at the moment)

My puzzle now is........

Ok, so why is the sodding lump of carbs and framework still feeling fixed tight to the top of the engine?

I've looked around and I can't see any other bolts holding it down. Am I missing something obvious?

So it's airbox off (obviously) throttle cable off, both metal bands around the short rubber pipes that connect the carbs to the engine stil in place but the tightening screws very undone.

Are we now at brute force and you need to find a long lever to force/pull the carbs up.
Or is there something else I need to undo, that I can't see ?

thanks

[popkat]

Lever between the rear cam cover and the centre of the rear carb, use a flat bar with plenty of rag for protection.. the bands nearest the cylinder head don't need to be undone, screw then back up you want to remove the carbs not the rubber stubs.. the chokes unscrew from the carb with 10mm spanner be VERY careful undoing and doing up they are only plastic and break easily.. the electrical connection is the throttle position sensor. there will also be 2 hoses for the coolant you need to take off the carbs.. don't undo the framework that holds the two carbs together you don't need to do this.

[Tempest]

Lever between the rear cam cover and the centre of the rear carb, use a flat bar with plenty of rag for protection.. the bands nearest the cylinder head don't need to be undone, screw then back up you want to remove the carbs not the rubber stubs.. the chokes unscrew from the carb with 10mm spanner be VERY careful undoing and doing up they are only plastic and break easily.. the electrical connection is the throttle position sensor. there will also be 2 hoses for the coolant you need to take off the carbs.. don't undo the framework that holds the two carbs together you don't need to do this.

Thanks.
Actually just after I posted that, I found a web site that said you just need a bit of (careful) brute force!

So I did

I used pliers and removed the two coolant hoses (that was a bit of a shock when I 1st saw blue liquid!)

Choke wise that other side said a bit different and I looked and looked and did it that other way.
I unscrewed the plastic nut from the back of the choke knob, disconnected it away from the frame, and pulled it thru, so the whole choke cable and know is still attached. there did not seem an easy obvious way of disconnecting the cables, so just left it all connected. be a bit of a pig to pull back thru (tight) but will manage it, and the least I disconnect cables the better.

So.... Time for 3 photos

[8541Hawk]

A quick tip if you ever remove them again.....There is no need to undo the throttle cables from the bracket that mounts to the carbs.

Instead of undoing the cables, just remove the 2 screws that fix the plate to the carbs and the whole assembly will lift off.

[Cadbury64]

Brave lad, Tempest. We'll make a mechanic out of you yet!

Just to clarify a few previous posts. Best practice when storing a bike long term is to drain the carb bowls before storing. Fuel will evaporate and leave deposits behind in jets and float valves and give problems.

The fuel tap on the tank is vacuum operated; a thin rubber hose comes from the rear cylinder inlet and attaches to the back of the petcock. When the engine runs the vacuum draws a diaphragm valve open so fuel can flow. The mechanical tap is just a back up. You can flip the tank completely upside down (it should not leak) and pull the petcock off to clean and dismantle, it's very easy. I had a similar drippy tap and cleaned it then replaced the rubber parts.

There are two main fuel hoses off either side of the petcock. The remaining hoses are a tank air vent and the overflow drain for the filler cap. There's also a single electrical connection for the low fuel light.


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[Tempest]

A quick tip if you ever remove them again.....There is no need to undo the throttle cables from the bracket that mounts to the carbs.

Instead of undoing the cables, just remove the 2 screws that fix the plate to the carbs and the whole assembly will lift off.

Thanks.

This is part of the problem.
1st time doing something, lot of guesswork.
You do it, then afterwards, people say, oh you did not have to do it like that!

Well if I knew before I started, then I would not have done it that way, but I was guessing!

Still, it's all off now. Just a case of deciding what to do now.

[Tempest]

Brave lad, Tempest. We'll make a mechanic out of you yet!

Just to clarify a few previous posts. Best practice when storing a bike long term is to drain the carb bowls before storing. Fuel will evaporate and leave deposits behind in jets and float valves and give problems.

The fuel tap on the tank is vacuum operated; a thin rubber hose comes from the rear cylinder inlet and attaches to the back of the petcock. When the engine runs the vacuum draws a diaphragm valve open so fuel can flow. The mechanical tap is just a back up. You can flip the tank completely upside down (it should not leak) and pull the petcock off to clean and dismantle, it's very easy. I had a similar drippy tap and cleaned it then replaced the rubber parts.

There are two main fuel hoses off either side of the petcock. The remaining hoses are a tank air vent and the overflow drain for the filler cap. There's also a single electrical connection for the low fuel light.


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Thanks for that, and yes, there was some fuel dripping into the little looped plastic bit at the back of the tank that's wrapped around the tap. Not much, just enough to see a damp fuel patch there.

Do you think the bit inside is cleanable, or would this dripping just mean replace this diaphram ?

[Tempest]

Now my carb assembly is out.......

And before I do something (and someone comes along afterwards and says, of you should of done it some other way!)

I'd love to hear advice here as to the best order of steps to take?

I could dump the whole thing in paraffin, or smother it with general engine cleaner (or best to just leave the outside alone?)

Then, is there any order of what to take off 1st, or bits I should just leave alone, and only certain bits I should unscrew to get to "Stuck/Gummed up bits?"

The only things I think I want to touch are take the float bowls off as thats where the crud is going to be.
What about the black caps at the top?

I suppose I need to take the jets out for cleaning?

As you can understand, the least I disturb things, the better I feel it will be.
But also, whilst it's out, I wish to give it the best clean I can, without being stupid and touching things that are best left alone.

Thanks.

Just some guidance as to the route to take, and what to use / what not to use as a cleaning sollution/method.

Car cleaner?
Fuel and a paint brush?
Scotch Bright pad to remove hard residue, or Nooooo not scotch bright it will scratch

Stuff like that.

thanks

[popkat]

Suck/blow on The 2 big rubber pipes coming off the side of the carbs, this will raise the slides, when raised they should smoothly come back down by them selves, as long as they do this then you shouldn't need to remove the tops.

Remove float bowl on one carb then clean that one, once happy do the other. The jets are different for each, this is best way to not muddle them up.. find the pilot mixture screw there's one for each carb located by the float bowl but outside of it, they are small brass screws. CAREFULLY screw in a quarter turn at a time and count how many quarters, when you feel light resistance stop, do not do up tight !. make note of how many quarter turns and then unscrew them all the was out, they are small and there's a small spring, washer and rubber o ring, don't lose them. look carefully to make sure they are both the same with very small taper on the end and are clean, then refit screw all the way in then count back the quarter turns until they are at the original setting.
With float bowls off remove the main jet and pilot jets and clean them, use brake cleaner, clean float bowl with brake cleaner too. blow out with air line, make sure you can see through the jets, that they are clear including the holes in the side of the pilot jet..

As bike has only been left 2 years hopefully they won't be that bad..

The fuel tank diaphragm can be cleaned, make sure your clear about how things go back together as you take it apart.

[Tempest]

Suck/blow etc etc......
As bike has only been left 2 years hopefully they won't be that bad..

The fuel tank diaphragm can be cleaned, make sure your clear about how things go back together as you take it apart.

Thank you very much for the great advice.

I just need to get a tin of (brand name?) STP Carb Cleaner I guess which I've been told will melt? away all this stuff, and make sure all tiny holes are clear.

I'm in no desperate rush, so I can take my time.

Thanks for the tip about the diaphram and blowing.....

[Cadbury64]

I know you've got plenty to do with the carb clean, but while they are out is the easiest time to reset the Throttle Position Sensor. That is the electrical gadget on the side of the carbs. Quite often they're not set too well at the factory, but if you have a multimeter it is an easy job to loosen the mounting screws and rotate the TPS until it has a resistance of 500 ohms between the upper two electrical pins. I found my bike to be much perkier off a closed throttle with this done.

[Tempest]

I know you've got plenty to do with the carb clean, but while they are out is the easiest time to reset the Throttle Position Sensor. That is the electrical gadget on the side of the carbs. Quite often they're not set too well at the factory, but if you have a multimeter it is an easy job to loosen the mounting screws and rotate the TPS until it has a resistance of 500 ohms between the upper two electrical pins. I found my bike to be much perkier off a closed throttle with this done.

Oh.. thanks for that.

I do have a multi meter, not 100% sure how to use the thing so will need to ask, but yes, I should be able to do that

Bought my 6 jets to work today (3 for each carb) and just cleaned again in the ultrasonic tank, nice to see some more crud float away from the jets, all super clean. Wish I had one at home.

I'd love to have free time at work, strip more and dunk the whole carb in a bigger ultrasonic tank, but I think some would moan if they saw me do that! lol

Still, I well flooded everything with carb cleaner, so in reality I think it's probably going to be fine.

Just debating if I need to pull out the needles? the diaphrams all work fine either by finger and just blowing down the pipes, all smooth and no sticking, so may just leave that all alone as no problem there.

[VTRDark]

Shame on you all as none of you have posted any links This is all on here to be found.

As it happens I am in Guildford at the moment so this will have to be a quick post, I'm back home tomorrow though. Looks like your endeavouring through it Tempest.

Here's a link to start with. Note the extra links at the bottom.
http://www.vtr1000.org/phpBB3/viewtopic ... 14#p238578

in particular the following:
http://www.vtr1000.org/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=25177

I saw those jets in your other thread. They look a bit manky. Stick your finger over the big hole at the end and poke the straw on the carb cleaning spray in the other end and this will help blast the crap out of the smaller hole that where mentioned. Don't get it in your eyes. Carb cleaning spray in the eye stings a lot. If you have access to an airline then this helps too. Give them a blast through. Also stick the straw and blast through any holes you see in the carb through around the butterfly flap. I would also remove the fuel mixture screws and blast through that passage too. You will see this squirt out into the throat. Don't forget to count the turns from fully seated out on the mixture screws before you take them out and don't forget the little spring, washer and O ring that sit there. You may have to pick the O ring out from inside otherwise it will blast out when you squirt spray in there and loose it.

Fuel......this will be stale after two years. Bin it and fill with Super for it's first fill as this contains cleaning additives that regular does not. Plugs......yeh change them, why not while your in there and they could help. TPS....I wouldn't bother right now as you are bound to have the carbs off again and tinkering with jetting or something now you have started Just get the bike started and running for now. A couple of hundred miles of fuel be blasted through with some spirited riding will clean a lot of things out and free up any petcock diaphragm sticking issues.

Give us a shout if you get stuck

Oh one more thing for now. Have you got a front vacuum take of pipe for balancing. This is defiantly worth putting on the next list if not.
http://www.vtr1000.org/phpBB3/viewtopic ... 31&t=18430

And another As for the diaphragms and with respect, considering you lack of knowledge, I would leave as is for now. You could be opening up a can of worms with getting the springs back in But then again you may want to give it a go. You could also blast through the hole the needle goes in then. Also try to keep carb cleaning spray away from any rubber components as it rots rubber.

(:-})

[Tempest]

Thanks for the helpful post.

Ok, well jets are as clean as clean can be, due to last night manual cleaning, with spray and today at work in ultrasonic tank.

I removed, and cleaned both the plastic floats (dried fuel on the plastic)
I took the float valves out with the little rubber 90' points and they are all cleaned.

I took those screws (you need to mark the position of) out, and cleaner those also scotchbright and carb cleaner)

Blasted car cleaner into all holes (will admit I did not see, or know about any rubber washers!) did not see any/look for any, or saw anything fly out.... (fingers crossed)

Ok, i'll leave the diaphrams alone as, to be honest, I think i'd only be taking them apart for the hell of it.
I just need to hold them open and use a cotton bud with carb cleaner to clean a bit of gunk of that main pin that rises up.

I would like to dump the whole think in an ultrasonic tank but logistical probs with that, and probaly that's me going a bit OTT

Yes, I did wonder about balancing... TBH, it would not of hurt to have it balanced irrespective of what I'm doing now.
Kinda hoping someone (with the gear) might be able to help me on that front as it will just be a 1 off thing for me.

Really, I want to get it back together, fresh fuel and see if it starts.....

THEN I can deal with plugs and beg for some balancing help!